DSLR and other system camera discussionThe place on DPNow.com for discussing Digital Single Lens Reflex camera issues and up and coming mirrorless or SLT system cameras.
I read an interview with Pentax persons by DC watch with interest and IMHO I think it is worth sharing. – as it is eight-page long, some excerpts only. One of the series of interviews by the site after PMA2008 and PIE2008 (camera show in Tokyo) and before Photokina2008.
Although it is titled as “ business strategy 2008 – Pentax”, the content is rather long-term one, as the sub title of the interview says “ (R&D of ) 645D will be definitely resumed.”
(Kindly note that I partially summarized words or in some cases added words in parenthesis, when I think it better/necessary.)
Interviewee: Pentax exec. Mr. Torikoshi (Tori), in charge of Pentax imaging system business unit at Hoya and Mr. Tatamiya (Tata), manager in charge
Interviewer: Honda san (like many other interviews by DC watch)
#(the first chapter: headline ) The M&A by Hoya did not raise disturbances at Pentax : --- omitted
#(the second chapter: headline) Short-term profit alone does not determine the future of Pentax --- omitted
#(the third chapter: headline) K20D – differentiated in IQ of landscape photos from others--- mostly omitted
Tatamiya (Tata) here says that Image Quality (IQ) of K10D was same as Samsung’s counter part. However, this time, although essential portions such as controls are in common and Pentax developed it exclusively, the firmwares of applications to be installed were independently developed. Consequently the IQ, functions and user interfaces are considerably different (between Pentax and Samsung).
#Samsung’s sensor – one of a good birth
I: Can the Samusung Techwin’s CMOS sensor be a key component part for differentiating K20D from others?
Tata: By comparison with other rival sensors, I think it is better than others. The signals from the sensor are of the very good quality.
I: Was K20D developed, assuming that the Samusung sensor was to be used?
Tata: The sensor installed on K20D has been jointly developed so it has been assumed that the sensor is to be used on some models. But when and on which models? – these had not been determined at the beginning. So in that sense, it was possible that the sensor was not installed on K20d. We evaluated various sensors including other brands, and as a result of it, we reached a conclusion that Samsung’s is better and therefore installed it.
I: In which sense, do you say it is better? Is it good at, say, S/N ratio that often cause problems in high density pixels?
Tata: Sensors performances can be evaluated in various ways. When simply talked about S/N ratio, it is better than other sensors of the same category. The sensor price is, however, more expensive than another brand. We believe that the price expensiveness is more than compensated by better performances, so made a decision to install the Samsung’s CMOS.
To be continued. Just headlines now.
#645 Digital has higher priorities than 35mm FF
#It is also necessary to add MF digital camera as a tool for hobbysts (not only for business/high end use)
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#645 Digital has higher priorities than 35mm FF
I: Do you plan to add a new model to DSLR in addition to the K two-digit series and K three-digit series? You announced earlier that the R&D of 645D was to be frozen. Don’t you plan to add 35mm FF model instead?
Tori: The lineup will be expanded. The digitalization of 645 camera is not “discontinuation” but is merely “frozen”. It was reported by some newspapers that it was “abolished” but Pentax oneself has never used the words such as “discontinued” or “abolishment”.
The reason we used the word “frozen” is that in this case we can resume it someday. The “freezing” of R&D of DSLR that makes good use of 645 system is undoubtedly lifted at an earlier time.
However, there are priorities (in business projects). Firstly in order to strengthen the foothold (of the business), we concentrate on making the two main stream models competitive enough and then we cancel the freezing of the R&D of MF camera(s) and plan to make a full use of the 645 MF assets we already have.
I will make it resume by all means. The new one will not be the one already developed in the past three years but will be different ones which should incorporate all the know-hows we accumulated during the processes. The models (exhibited at various shows) had been near the point of commercialization. If we just bring those that already finished the R&D into the markets, then it would be too old. So we start it from scratch newly.
I: Then you do not have a plan of developing high-end model(s) of 35mm cameras?
Tori: If the product concepts can be clearly determined, then I think that there can be a product development plan. (In that sense,) I would not deny the possibilities. It is a theme we should challenge in future. If we can successfully establish/draw a business model, then we want to challenge it.
[my comment: If I may put it shortly, he is saying that if Pentax can be sure that 35mm FF modles can be a good seller in the markets then Pentax will do it. At this point of time, however, they are not that confident. Sorry Pentax, if this interpretation is not correct. But your comments are --- well, just too much diplomatic, IMHO.]
When we talk about priorities, 645D has a higher priority for Pentax. We are doing R&D of 35mm FF model(s) and will continuously do so in future as well. However, for Pentax manpower, to make R&D of 35mm FF in parallel with 645D is just too much. We firstly launch 645D and after that I do not deny the possibility of developing 35mm FF.
I: Does the lens lineup change in view of the future possible 35mm FF? Or will it be too far away so it would not be necessary at the moment to review the current lens lineup?
Tori: First of all, we need to complete the DSLR system. Until now we have introduced bodies with APS-C sensor and lenses for the system. Our current duty is to perfect the lineup of DA lens system. As I said earlier, we do conduct the research and development of 35mm FF bodies. However, when talking about the commercialization [i.e. product launch], it is completely a different story. Some may say you have FA lenses that can cope with FF sensor. But if I may ask whether all the FA lenses can perfectly cope with FF sensor, then I suspect some of them do not. We need to think of it as a perfection of a system and in that sense, we can not commercialize it (35mm FF body) so easily.
************* #It is also necessary to add an MF digital camera as a tool for hobbysts (not only for business/high end use)
I: You implied that in a near future the product planning of 645D will be resumed. Will it be a high-end product aimed at business (professional) uses?
Tori: It will be a product that can fully capture landscapes so it should be one that has high image quality. At initial stage (of the R&D), 645D had 18 M pixels only but we changed it to 30 Mp later as we thought it better for an ideal landscape camera.
When it is resumed, it would be a model which entails total solution that has high Mega pixel, high image quality that can be usable for landscape photos and also that can be suitable for business (professional) purposes. When taking into account needs of various usages such as advertising use, studio use and printing (publishing) use, it must be a camera not only excellent as an input gear but also the one that can provide system solution (with those professional users) that covers from the input to the output. True, not all the processes are developed internally, but our proposal (that is, the camera Pentax is going to propose to the markets) should have consistency.
On the other hand, there are many consumer users in Japan who use MF cameras. So I also think it necessary to propose another [affordable] MF camera that can meet their expectation --- an MF camera as a tool of hobby.
I: Then are you planning to develop two kinds of MF digital cameras, one for professional uses and another for hobbyists?
Tori: Ideally two, yes, but not be able to do so from the very beginning. During the film era, Pentax was developing an expensive high-end 645 SLR. But this project was stopped. We did not think that such a camera could be sold well. What the markets wanted was a 645 SLR that can be purchased for 100K thousands yen (approx. US $ 1000 or 630 Euros). There were many users who said they would but it if the price level was at that level. Those were the people who were interested in MF cameras, so if we could provide a body at suitable price level, then they would surely add lenses later.
We would not be able to create markets without our due efforts to provide more opportunities with them so that users can understand advantages/attractiveness of MF cameras.
In this sense I would like to challenge in future an affordable 645 DSLR. There should be users who want a large format camera for their personal hobby use and not for business use. It is our dream to have two models. The first one (that is, for professional uses) would be, however, the one which can be accepted by wider range of users, though.
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My remarks: If you think the translation is not good, kindly point it out to me. I would try more to improve it. I know it's not good.
Pentax once announced 35mm FF model (K1) some years back, so I do believe their capability of developing such a camera but … it (the original K1) was just too early and now I’m afraid it might be too late? They have just too long pondering period, while observing how the FF markets will grow.
In this context, I think giving more priority to 645D looks like reasonable, if Pentax is not satisfied with current simple model lineup of APS-C size.
I do not think even Canon is getting profits from FF models. We, APS-C users, are contributing largely to their profits. Pentax badly needs more profits. That is required by Hoya - well, it might be in the long term but who knows how long the "long term" is?
I really wonder whether they can justify those product plannings from financial/business viewpoints – not from technical viewpoints. It is however true that Pentax seems to be the No.3 in our market at the moment. Sony will probably grow to some extent in a few years, though.
Good to have more competition in MF digital markets, if it is true. It is atm prohibitively expensive.
yoshi
p.s. A photo of the prototype of K1 is attached as a thumbnail. (taken by me)
The second one is the said 30MP sensor planned for 645D (copied from DC.watch)
A photographer said in his blog today (Aug. 7) something like this.
"There seems to be a campaign among Pentax users that strongly request the introduction of 35mm FF models. I (=the photographer) am personally against that campaign. Pentax has (film) 645 MF camera and that's the market where Canon/Nikon cannot enter into.
I happened to have an opportunity to use an "alpa" prototype of the so-called 645D recently. It's not "beta" at all but I got the impression that it can be launched at any time soon. The IQ is quite good and imagine it's better than 35mm FF models.
Pentax should lauch 645D ASAP and not the 35mm FF. How about to start another campaign of requesting immediate launch of 645D?"
This is his (name: Tanaka) opinion. What do you think?
yoshi
p.s. He did comment that the price would be the real issue. He requested 800K yen or less.
I must say that from what I have seen, the Samsung CMOS sensor used in the Pentax K20D and the Samsung G20 is an excellent first effort. It has good noise characteristics and no sign that I can see of banding at high ISO. Panasonic's MOS sensors used in Four Thirds cameras are certainly out-shone by the Samsung sensor at high ISOs, whic h is interesting as they have virtually the same pixel pitch.
A photographer said in his blog today (Aug. 7) something like this.
"There seems to be a campaign among Pentax users that strongly request the introduction of 35mm FF models. I (=the photographer) am personally against that campaign. Pentax has (film) 645 MF camera and that's the market where Canon/Nikon cannot enter into.
I happened to have an opportunity to use an "alpa" prototype of the so-called 645D recently. It's not "beta" at all but I got the impression that it can be launched at any time soon. The IQ is quite good and imagine it's better than 35mm FF models.
Pentax should lauch 645D ASAP and not the 35mm FF. How about to start another campaign of requesting immediate launch of 645D?"
This is his (name: Tanaka) opinion. What do you think?
yoshi
p.s. He did comment that the price would be the real issue. He requested 800K yen or less.
That's about £3,000? Much cheaper than a Hasselblad!
With Sony about to enter FF, it's going to be much harder for Pentax to compete, so I think the MF direction looks sensible.
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