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Ink jet photo printers and printing Problem with your ink jet printer or are you exploring ways of making your prints ever more vibrant and pleasing. Post your ink jet printer posers here.

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Old 17-01-11
rogleale rogleale is offline
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Exclamation Tempted by Third Party Inks

I use two Canon printers, an i9950 and a Pro 9000 MKll. Before I bought the Pro 9000 I used the 9950 with third party inks for proof printing before sending pictures that I had sold, or intended as presents, to a print lab for printing.
With the Pro9000 I decided to stick with the Canon inks, having seen good reports of the ChromaLife inks, but decided that I would do my own, even if rather limited, durability testing. I printed a test image on Canon paper using the third party inks on the 9950, and another on the Pro9000 using the ChromaLife inks. The prints were placed on the side of a kitchen cabinet, beside a west facing window, near to the kitchen sink and directly above a coffee machine and an electric kettle in daily use. I couldn't think of worse place for them other than in direct sunlight, which would have been too harsh.
The results of this test are shown after a six month exposure to the elements. I am really surprised that the Canon inks stood up to it so well, and am confident enough to now provide prints from my Pro9000 MKll to buyers. I imagine that mounted under glass the images will outlive their owners. I must point out that I have done no PP on these test prints but the cheap ink result is obvious!

The Test Se




After Six Months.



Roger
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogleale View Post
I use two Canon printers, an i9950 and a Pro 9000 MKll. Before I bought the Pro 9000 I used the 9950 with third party inks for proof printing before sending pictures that I had sold, or intended as presents, to a print lab for printing.
With the Pro9000 I decided to stick with the Canon inks, having seen good reports of the ChromaLife inks, but decided that I would do my own, even if rather limited, durability testing. I printed a test image on Canon paper using the third party inks on the 9950, and another on the Pro9000 using the ChromaLife inks. The prints were placed on the side of a kitchen cabinet, beside a west facing window, near to the kitchen sink and directly above a coffee machine and an electric kettle in daily use. I couldn't think of worse place for them other than in direct sunlight, which would have been too harsh.
The results of this test are shown after a six month exposure to the elements. I am really surprised that the Canon inks stood up to it so well, and am confident enough to now provide prints from my Pro9000 MKll to buyers. I imagine that mounted under glass the images will outlive their owners. I must point out that I have done no PP on these test prints but the cheap ink result is obvious!

The Test Se




After Six Months.



Roger
Valuable test in my opinion.

This subject has been covered many times on DP now but to the best of my knowledge you are the first to do a fade test.
I take it the genuine Canon inks are pigment (not up on Canon printers these days) were the compatible pigment or dye? I know many of the compatible inks are dye even when listed for a pigment printer, you only have to look at eBay to see that. Dye inks were never as permanent as pigment, even genuine ones. It was always one of the issues early in consumer digital printing.
I used a Canon printer a number of years ago it was excellent in its day. It was a dye printer (before pigment was the first option) and did fade badly if exposed to the air & strong light, even with genuine inks, which I always used.
I use the Eco Flow System from PemaJet on my new Epson R2880 (my Epson R2400 giving up a couple of weeks ago also fitted with EFS) they are pigment ink and are guaranteed I think for 25 years no fade. The ink is not cheap but more economic than using Epson cartridges. They don't do a version for Canon, preferring to concentrate on Epson.

Patrick
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Old 17-01-11
rogleale rogleale is offline
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

That's the real surprise Patrick - the ChromaLife inks are dye, not pigment, so there should be no clogging problems.

Roger
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

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Originally Posted by rogleale View Post
That's the real surprise Patrick - the ChromaLife inks are dye, not pigment, so there should be no clogging problems.

Roger
Obviously dye ink technology has improved over the years, and if Canon are concentrating on dye ink they had to improve them to compete with pigment.
Blockage problems with pigmant are not the issue many make it our to be, I had on the Canon some blockage problems now and then and have had only minor ones with pigment on the Epson. One of the problems you can get with the flow system is air leakage if its necessary to recharge the flow system, damage can be caused to the rubber seal when done regularly, and you get what looks like blockage but is in fact air seeping in and effecting the print in the same way. I had the problem swapping to Matte ink from PK ink for art papers. I now won't swap them over but use the same ink for both media types, a compromise its true for the art paper but these days I don't use it much anyway.

It is best if the printer is not being used for some time, to do a nozzle check about once a week to make sure the heads are kept clear, and with the flow system clamp the tubes. Regular usage prevents the need for this.
I think the regular nozzle check is good practice for a little used printer pigment or dye.
Some reports recommend the printer never to be shut off but be left switched on at all times.

Patrick

Last edited by Patrick; 17-01-11 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

Yes, all the main printer manufacturers have made a lot of progress with dye-based inks in the last five years. Epson now claims 100+ years of life with their dye based inks. The only caveat I can see is that you need to be careful what you are printing on as these inks depend on the paper characteristics for their longevity.

Ian
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

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Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Yes, all the main printer manufacturers have made a lot of progress with dye-based inks in the last five years. Epson now claims 100+ years of life with their dye based inks. The only caveat I can see is that you need to be careful what you are printing on as these inks depend on the paper characteristics for their longevity.

Ian
I only usually print for exhibition these days and want maximum quality, therefore I only use fibre based paper. Favorite is Permajet Royal just off white, or Permajet Distinction a bright white. Fibre paper gives good rich blacks so much better than the normal resin papers, but then you would expect something for the money @ up to 2 and more per sheet for an A3. We used to get this same better quality in the old darkroom days using fibre paper as apposed to resin.
My experience now is with pigment ink, but would imagine the same higher quality using dye ink, particularly as they have a reputation for more saturation than pigment, but then pigment inks have experienced their own improvements also. When I used the Canon and before that an Epson EX both dye ink printers, resin papers had not been marketed.
Much of the quality improvements we now enjoy I believe is probably down to better paper technology than ink improvements, permanence accepted.

Patrick
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

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Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
I only usually print for exhibition these days and want maximum quality, therefore I only use fibre based paper. Favorite is Permajet Royal just off white, or Permajet Distinction a bright white. Fibre paper gives good rich blacks so much better than the normal resin papers, but then you would expect something for the money @ up to 2 and more per sheet for an A3. We used to get this same better quality in the old darkroom days using fibre paper as apposed to resin.
My experience now is with pigment ink, but would imagine the same higher quality using dye ink, particularly as they have a reputation for more saturation than pigment, but then pigment inks have experienced their own improvements also. When I used the Canon and before that an Epson EX both dye ink printers, resin papers had not been marketed.
Much of the quality improvements we now enjoy I believe is probably down to better paper technology than ink improvements, permanence accepted.

Patrick
Dye-based inks really only work well with micro porous coated papers, and I'm not sure that dye-based inks would be as long lasting on fine art or fibre-based papers, which are really formulated for pigmented inks.

Ian
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Old 17-01-11
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Re: Tempted by Third Party Inks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Dye-based inks really only work well with micro porous coated papers, and I'm not sure that dye-based inks would be as long lasting on fine art or fibre-based papers, which are really formulated for pigmented inks.

Ian
Now you mention it a feel I read that somewhere.

Patrick
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