Digital Photography Now - www.dpnow.com  
 
advertisements

Go Back   DPNow.com Discussion Forum > Hard copy > Ink jet photo printers and printing

Ink jet photo printers and printing Problem with your ink jet printer or are you exploring ways of making your prints ever more vibrant and pleasing. Post your ink jet printer posers here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 30-11-06
dave8890 dave8890 is offline
Forum newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
dave8890 is on a distinguished road
R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Hi all,
has anyone with an Epson R800 had problems with the matte black being used up even though they are printing gloss images?? my matte black is nearly empty and considering the price of these inks im not happy, ive not printed any matte images or documents at all, only ever ran the head clean function once so surely it cant be that,
any help greatly appreciated
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 30-11-06
Ian's Avatar
Ian Ian is offline
Admin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hemel Hempstead UK
Posts: 10,331
Blog Entries: 282
Thanks: 99
Thanked 155 Times in 133 Posts
Likes: 435
Liked at 248 Times in 196 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Ian is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by dave8890 View Post
Hi all,
has anyone with an Epson R800 had problems with the matte black being used up even though they are printing gloss images?? my matte black is nearly empty and considering the price of these inks im not happy, ive not printed any matte images or documents at all, only ever ran the head clean function once so surely it cant be that,
any help greatly appreciated
Hi Dave and welcome to the DPNow forum!

Unfortunately, print head maintenance does use some ink from all the cartridges during each maintenance cycle. Your printer will not only use ink when you force a head cleaning cycle, but at regular predetermined intervals during the life of the printer as a preventative measure.

How old is your R800?

Ian
__________________
Founder/editor
Digital Photography Now (DPNow.com)
Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 30-11-06
bigbob's Avatar
bigbob bigbob is offline
Forum veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North Kent U.K.
Posts: 287
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
bigbob is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Dave i've printed off about 20 high res photos since i recharged all my inks , the magenta and cyan are always the first to run out but i've not noticed any appriecable difference in the ways blacks are used , i use the gloss optimiser on all my print outs .
As for prices if you search the net you can find genuine epsom inks at bargain prices , i think a full set cost me 70 .
Heres a print out of my moniter3 showing usage after 20 prints .
Not much help to you , but it does show that it's proberbly not the R800 , but just your R800 .
B..
Attached Thumbnails
Untitled-1.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-12-06
Ian's Avatar
Ian Ian is offline
Admin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hemel Hempstead UK
Posts: 10,331
Blog Entries: 282
Thanks: 99
Thanked 155 Times in 133 Posts
Likes: 435
Liked at 248 Times in 196 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Ian is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbob View Post
Dave i've printed off about 20 high res photos since i recharged all my inks , the magenta and cyan are always the first to run out but i've not noticed any appriecable difference in the ways blacks are used , i use the gloss optimiser on all my print outs .
As for prices if you search the net you can find genuine epsom inks at bargain prices , i think a full set cost me 70 .
Heres a print out of my moniter3 showing usage after 20 prints .
Not much help to you , but it does show that it's proberbly not the R800 , but just your R800 .
B..
Bob, how many cleaning cycles have you run and how many times has the printer been switched on and off since you installed the new cartridges? I'd wager Dave's matt black cartridge has been in the printer a very long time and that he's had to use head-cleaning quite a bit over that period.

Another point is that as it's likely Dave's matt cartridge is the original one, a fair amount if its ink would have been used up in the initial from brand new charging of the print head. This would not show up as a factor in replaced cartridges.

Ian
__________________
Founder/editor
Digital Photography Now (DPNow.com)
Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-12-06
dave8890 dave8890 is offline
Forum newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
dave8890 is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Ian and bob, thanks for your reply's,
I think Ian hit the nail on the head, the printers about a year old but used very irregulary and yes the matte black is still the original one, although from what i can remember up till recently the matte black was only about 1/8th down and the colour inks about a quarter used, i recently had to run off around 50 glossy a4's and during this time i ran out of yellow,magenta,cyan,photo black and gloss optimiser. It was during this recent printing marathon that i noticed the matte black going down to about a quarter left, damn this is going to be a very expensive printer to use.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-12-06
Ian's Avatar
Ian Ian is offline
Admin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hemel Hempstead UK
Posts: 10,331
Blog Entries: 282
Thanks: 99
Thanked 155 Times in 133 Posts
Likes: 435
Liked at 248 Times in 196 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Ian is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by dave8890 View Post
Ian and bob, thanks for your reply's,
I think Ian hit the nail on the head, the printers about a year old but used very irregulary and yes the matte black is still the original one, although from what i can remember up till recently the matte black was only about 1/8th down and the colour inks about a quarter used, i recently had to run off around 50 glossy a4's and during this time i ran out of yellow,magenta,cyan,photo black and gloss optimiser. It was during this recent printing marathon that i noticed the matte black going down to about a quarter left, damn this is going to be a very expensive printer to use.
Well, I believe you should be able to print 50 A4s from one set of inks at least and that's about 80 worth if ink and 19 paper, or about 2 per print, which is about what you would pay a good quality photo printing services for 50 A4s.

Of course that doesn't factor in the cost of the printer in the first place. If you bought the printer for, say, 200, with, for argument's sake, 75% usable ink after priming the print head, and you printed 500 A4s in the life of the printer, you'd be looking at a per print cost, overall, of around 2.07 per A4 print.

It's a myth to think that printing at home will save you money in most cases. But what printing at home does is provide complete control over the printing process, giving you great flexibility in achieving the right quality and enabling you to print when and where you like, instantly.

Ian
__________________
Founder/editor
Digital Photography Now (DPNow.com)
Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-12-06
JSR's Avatar
JSR JSR is offline
Forum veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 694
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 0
JSR is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by dave8890 View Post
Ian and bob, thanks for your reply's,
I think Ian hit the nail on the head, the printers about a year old but used very irregulary and yes the matte black is still the original one, although from what i can remember up till recently the matte black was only about 1/8th down and the colour inks about a quarter used, i recently had to run off around 50 glossy a4's and during this time i ran out of yellow,magenta,cyan,photo black and gloss optimiser. It was during this recent printing marathon that i noticed the matte black going down to about a quarter left, damn this is going to be a very expensive printer to use.
Each time you replace an ink cartridge, all of the ink tanks are purged by a couple of %. If you've replaced 5 cartridges separately, that's five times the matte black will have been purged by a few percent. Add that to regular maintenance and head cleans, and that's where the matte black is going. I noticed it when I first bought my R1800 and didn't print any matte prints.

You'll find yourself saving money if, each time you have to replace one cartridge, look for any other that's below 20% (C,M,Y) or below 10% (R,B) and replace those at the same time. The ink wasted is insignificant compared to how much gets wasted from the other tanks each time you change a cartridge.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-12-06
JSR's Avatar
JSR JSR is offline
Forum veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 694
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 0
JSR is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Well, I believe you should be able to print 50 A4s from one set of inks at least and that's about 80 worth if ink and 19 paper, or about 2 per print, which is about what you would pay a good quality photo printing services for 50 A4s.
50? How different is the R800 to the R1800?

I've mentioned before that I've been logging my ink usage of my R1800 since I bought it 18 months ago and I use a spreadsheet to extrapolate the cost per print based on print area and ink cost. I've recently added a new calculation to work out how many prints of any particular type could be obtained using all the ink in one complete set of cartridges. For A4s, that comes in at 98.8.

Naturally, my figures are based on prints I've made in the real world and anyone else's photos may produce a slightly different cost - although it should be good enough for a rough estimate. These days, my printing has been about 50/50 glossy and matte - in the beginning it was 95% glossy. Cost of ink for an A4 photo from my R1800 averages 82p. I would hope that the R800, using the same ink tanks, is somewhere in the same region.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-12-06
Ian's Avatar
Ian Ian is offline
Admin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hemel Hempstead UK
Posts: 10,331
Blog Entries: 282
Thanks: 99
Thanked 155 Times in 133 Posts
Likes: 435
Liked at 248 Times in 196 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Ian is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR View Post
50? How different is the R800 to the R1800?

I've mentioned before that I've been logging my ink usage of my R1800 since I bought it 18 months ago and I use a spreadsheet to extrapolate the cost per print based on print area and ink cost. I've recently added a new calculation to work out how many prints of any particular type could be obtained using all the ink in one complete set of cartridges. For A4s, that comes in at 98.8.

Naturally, my figures are based on prints I've made in the real world and anyone else's photos may produce a slightly different cost - although it should be good enough for a rough estimate. These days, my printing has been about 50/50 glossy and matte - in the beginning it was 95% glossy. Cost of ink for an A4 photo from my R1800 averages 82p. I would hope that the R800, using the same ink tanks, is somewhere in the same region.
Well, I admit my calculations are simplistic in this case, based on 'at least' an arbitrary 50 A4 prints from a set of cartridges. I didn't refer to my run down test results, not sure if I have any for the R800 or R1800 anyway, but even so, my test methodology has been to do a continuous run down test and this is, quite clearly, not much use to the typical user as a great deal of ink is consumed in head maintenance cycles over an extended period of time during the life of each cartridge.

I'm not even sure your costings would be a good yardstick for Dave's. I would guess you are a frequent and heavy user of your printer and this means you would get a better return than Dave, who looks to be an occasional user, doing a few prints here or there, mostly. He would experience much more ink wastage to maintenance cycles than you.

The only way to get decent costings is to emulate a target user's printer activity over time, maybe 2-3 months at least.

It's a bit like car petrol consumption - government figures represent simulated urban driving and long distance motorway driving. You're probably a motorway driver and Dave is probably an urban driver

Ian
__________________
Founder/editor
Digital Photography Now (DPNow.com)
Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-12-06
Ian's Avatar
Ian Ian is offline
Admin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hemel Hempstead UK
Posts: 10,331
Blog Entries: 282
Thanks: 99
Thanked 155 Times in 133 Posts
Likes: 435
Liked at 248 Times in 196 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Ian is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR View Post
Each time you replace an ink cartridge, all of the ink tanks are purged by a couple of %. If you've replaced 5 cartridges separately, that's five times the matte black will have been purged by a few percent. Add that to regular maintenance and head cleans, and that's where the matte black is going. I noticed it when I first bought my R1800 and didn't print any matte prints.

You'll find yourself saving money if, each time you have to replace one cartridge, look for any other that's below 20% (C,M,Y) or below 10% (R,B) and replace those at the same time. The ink wasted is insignificant compared to how much gets wasted from the other tanks each time you change a cartridge.
I think that's very good advice

Ian
__________________
Founder/editor
Digital Photography Now (DPNow.com)
Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-12-06
JSR's Avatar
JSR JSR is offline
Forum veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 694
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 0
JSR is on a distinguished road
Re: R800 using matte black but ive not printed matte

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Well, I admit my calculations are simplistic in this case, based on 'at least' an arbitrary 50 A4 prints from a set of cartridges. I didn't refer to my run down test results, not sure if I have any for the R800 or R1800 anyway, but even so, my test methodology has been to do a continuous run down test and this is, quite clearly, not much use to the typical user as a great deal of ink is consumed in head maintenance cycles over an extended period of time during the life of each cartridge.

I'm not even sure your costings would be a good yardstick for Dave's. I would guess you are a frequent and heavy user of your printer and this means you would get a better return than Dave, who looks to be an occasional user, doing a few prints here or there, mostly. He would experience much more ink wastage to maintenance cycles than you.

The only way to get decent costings is to emulate a target user's printer activity over time, maybe 2-3 months at least.

It's a bit like car petrol consumption - government figures represent simulated urban driving and long distance motorway driving. You're probably a motorway driver and Dave is probably an urban driver

Ian
Actually, I don't consider myself a heavy user - although I'm not real sure what constitutes heavy use. Due to the fact that I have several printers here, each for different tasks, the R1800 only gets used when I want top quality photos. I've logged just 992 prints from my R1800 - and a good proportion of those have been, surprisingly, printable CDs and DVDs! (I never thought I'd ever use that feature, but I had a lot of old CDs and DVDs to organise a few months back.)

Most of my 6"x4" snapshots are printed on my Picturemate these days - so the R1800 may go for a good few days without printing anything, and then only printing one or two things before standing idle again. I've recently started doing more work on it - with long panorama prints, and I hope to spend more time on that in the near future - but I don't see my use of the R1800 has particularly heavy.

Either way, I suspect a "light occasional user" could expect to end up with something between your 50 and my 98 as I do think your 50 estimate is quite low indeed, with much heavier users probably doing a little bit better. (Heavy users shouldn't be using the R1800 anyway because of the small ink tanks, but that's a different discussion. )
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Black and White OlyPaul Eye of the camera 0 27-03-13 03:56 PM
The man in black Caz Photo critique 1 31-01-11 10:36 AM
Ferrari on Black ash Photo critique 4 30-04-08 04:37 AM
Epson Launches A3+ and A2 Enhanced Matte Poster Board sheets DPNow Latest DPNow articles 0 06-02-07 04:50 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:43 AM.


Digital Photography Now, 2001-2018, All rights reservedAd Management plugin by RedTyger