View Full Version : Motorway Rant!!
coupekid
23-10-07, 11:51 AM
OK, got to get this off my chest!
Went down to Somerset yesterday, and had a lovely day. However, what is it that when motorists join a Motorway, they turn into morons!
We were held up for around a half hour, why? Because of a minor shunt! One car tapping the back of another, causing every driver to slow down and have a good look.
Also, why is it, that some people think that just because they are doing 70mph, they can sit in the middle lane pottering along. I even came accross someone doing 70 in the outside lane, not letting anyone by!
I generally like to cruise along at 80mph, which may sound illegal, but in actual fact, factoring in the error of a speedo, its probably almost exactly a true 70mph. So when I come accross this fools, it makes my blood boil. Especially when they end up with a huge queue of traffic behind them.
This and some idiots on motorbikes, who thought it was a good idea to come storming passed me, then pull in and slow dow in front of me, making me over take over and over again.....well, after the third time, a loud blow on the wash wipe soon made them drop back! Nothing like covering a smart a@#e biker in screen fluid to calm the nerves! *LOL
OK, Rant over.......and ......relax.......
OK, got to get this off my chest!
Went down to Somerset yesterday, and had a lovely day. However, what is it that when motorists join a Motorway, they turn into morons!
We were held up for around a half hour, why? Because of a minor shunt! One car tapping the back of another, causing every driver to slow down and have a good look.
Also, why is it, that some people think that just because they are doing 70mph, they can sit in the middle lane pottering along. I even came accross someone doing 70 in the outside lane, not letting anyone by!
I generally like to cruise along at 80mph, which may sound illegal, but in actual fact, factoring in the error of a speedo, its probably almost exactly a true 70mph. So when I come accross this fools, it makes my blood boil. Especially when they end up with a huge queue of traffic behind them.
This and some idiots on motorbikes, who thought it was a good idea to come storming passed me, then pull in and slow dow in front of me, making me over take over and over again.....well, after the third time, a loud blow on the wash wipe soon made them drop back! Nothing like covering a smart a@#e biker in screen fluid to calm the nerves! *LOL
OK, Rant over.......and ......relax.......
Got to say Ben that what you have just posted makes me think that you should re-think your driving attitude. 80 mph could also be nearer 90 mph the error works both ways. Spraying screen fluid over a bikers visor is not very cleaver as he has no means of cleaning it and could cause him to lose vision. Take a pill and calm down before getting behind the wheel. It will pay in the long run.;)
Remember, it's better to arrive late than never arrive at all.
Patrick
23-10-07, 01:02 PM
OK, got to get this off my chest!
Went down to Somerset yesterday, and had a lovely day. However, what is it that when motorists join a Motorway, they turn into morons!
We were held up for around a half hour, why? Because of a minor shunt! One car tapping the back of another, causing every driver to slow down and have a good look.
Also, why is it, that some people think that just because they are doing 70mph, they can sit in the middle lane pottering along. I even came accross someone doing 70 in the outside lane, not letting anyone by!
I generally like to cruise along at 80mph, which may sound illegal, but in actual fact, factoring in the error of a speedo, its probably almost exactly a true 70mph. So when I come accross this fools, it makes my blood boil. Especially when they end up with a huge queue of traffic behind them.
This and some idiots on motorbikes, who thought it was a good idea to come storming passed me, then pull in and slow dow in front of me, making me over take over and over again.....well, after the third time, a loud blow on the wash wipe soon made them drop back! Nothing like covering a smart a@#e biker in screen fluid to calm the nerves! *LOL
OK, Rant over.......and ......relax.......
I freely admit to being one of those fools in the middle lane at 70mph.
Why because at 70 on the inside lane the driver has to keep moving in and out of the slow traffic going 40, 50 possibly 60 and this is the most crowded lane of the three (four on some stretches of road). Driving at 70 I am not holding anyone up that is driving at a legal speed. If someone wants to go faster then there is always the outside lane.
However I do fully agree with your comment on the 70mph driver in the outside lane that is not in an overtaking maneuver, and am equally irritated at a middle lane driver doing 50 or 60 mph, they are holding up others.
Patrick
coupekid
23-10-07, 02:39 PM
Got to say Ben that what you have just posted makes me think that you should re-think your driving attitude. 80 mph could also be nearer 90 mph the error works both ways. Spraying screen fluid over a bikers visor is not very cleaver as he has no means of cleaning it and could cause him to lose vision. Take a pill and calm down before getting behind the wheel. It will pay in the long run.;)
Remember, it's better to arrive late than never arrive at all.
Not at all Ron.
I have taken an advanced driving test twice, and passed.
I also know that my speedo reads fast.
If some idiot on a motorbike wants to play silly beggars with me by overtaking, then slowing up, causing me to overtake, and then have him tail gate me with full beam on. I would much rather give him a dose of wash wipe and make him back off, than have the fool come through the back window.
coupekid
23-10-07, 02:44 PM
I freely admit to being one of those fools in the middle lane at 70mph.
Why because at 70 on the inside lane the driver has to keep moving in and out of the slow traffic going 40, 50 possibly 60 and this is the most crowded lane of the three (four on some stretches of road). Driving at 70 I am not holding anyone up that is driving at a legal speed. If someone wants to go faster then there is always the outside lane.
However I do fully agree with your comment on the 70mph driver in the outside lane that is not in an overtaking maneuver, and am equally irritated at a middle lane driver doing 50 or 60 mph, they are holding up others.
Patrick
Oh dear Patrick........
264
You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past. Slow-moving or speed-restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform or by signs.
'quote from the Highwaycode'
Not at all Ron.
I have taken an advanced driving test twice, and passed.
I also know that my speedo reads fast.
If some idiot on a motorbike wants to play silly beggars with me by overtaking, then slowing up, causing me to overtake, and then have him tail gate me with full beam on. I would much rather give him a dose of wash wipe and make him back off, than have the fool come through the back window.
Well Ben you should know better. I've only passed my advance driving test once but I also did a full years training with BSM to become a driving instructor (three test involved for that) plus I have done the Police driving with skill course. I'm still not qualified to drive like you say you do.:rolleyes:
I once read this on a tombstone:-
Here lies the body of Johnny Grey
Who died defending his right of way
He was right so right as he sped along
But he's just as dead as if he was wrong.
I freely admit to being one of those fools in the middle lane at 70mph.
Why because at 70 on the inside lane the driver has to keep moving in and out of the slow traffic going 40, 50 possibly 60 and this is the most crowded lane of the three (four on some stretches of road). Driving at 70 I am not holding anyone up that is driving at a legal speed. If someone wants to go faster then there is always the outside lane.
However I do fully agree with your comment on the 70mph driver in the outside lane that is not in an overtaking maneuver, and am equally irritated at a middle lane driver doing 50 or 60 mph, they are holding up others.
Patrick
I personally don't have a problem with someone passing slower traffic at 70 in the centre lane, but if there is a big gap to the next car in the left lane, you really should re-join that lane if there is traffic directly behind you. Just my opinion. It's people who stay, for ever, no matter how much space there is in the left lane, that wind me up.
Ian
Patrick
23-10-07, 05:27 PM
Oh dear Patrick........
264
You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past. Slow-moving or speed-restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform or by signs.
'quote from the Highwaycode'
Did you read my post properly? the point is when on the M6 or M1 can you tell me when the inside lane is clear to do 70mph between the hours of 7:00 am to as late as 9:00pm, the answer, never I know I almost feel as if I live on the motorway with the miles I do.
When its clear I use it, but it rarely is for sufficient distance and any driver trying would be in and out of the inside lane like a sailor on leave.
The Highway Code also says the speed limit on a motorway is 70mph not 80, and 60 on A road duel carriage or not, unless its an A road with an M classification like the A1(M)
Patrick
coupekid
23-10-07, 07:16 PM
Did you read my post properly? the point is when on the M6 or M1 can you tell me when the inside lane is clear to do 70mph between the hours of 7:00 am to as late as 9:00pm, the answer, never I know I almost feel as if I live on the motorway with the miles I do.
When its clear I use it, but it rarely is for sufficient distance and any driver trying would be in and out of the inside lane like a sailor on leave.
The Highway Code also says the speed limit on a motorway is 70mph not 80, and 60 on A road duel carriage or not, unless its an A road with an M classification like the A1(M)
Patrick
Actually Patrick, I think you may find the speed limit on a Dual Carriageway is 70, not 60. (unless otherwise sign posted to the contrary) :D
Bearface
23-10-07, 07:32 PM
Did you read my post properly? the point is when on the M6 or M1 can you tell me when the inside lane is clear to do 70mph between the hours of 7:00 am to as late as 9:00pm, the answer, never I know I almost feel as if I live on the motorway with the miles I do.
When its clear I use it, but it rarely is for sufficient distance and any driver trying would be in and out of the inside lane like a sailor on leave.
The Highway Code also says the speed limit on a motorway is 70mph not 80, and 60 on A road duel carriage or not, unless its an A road with an M classification like the A1(M)
Patrick
Wow, there's lot's of credential-waving, pedantry and righteous indignation in this short thread, isn't there..? :rolleyes:
80mph certainly isn't a silly motorway speed these days, but of course it depends on the conditions (traffic levels, environment and weather) at the time. However no matter how you look at it, the speed limit is 70mph and so at 80, you are breaking the law. The approach by many forces is to give drivers a 10% margin for error plus around three MPH in terms of leeway, but this still assumes that the conditions are appropriate and that the driver is operating his or her vehicle in a competent fashion. In other words, 80mph can still get you a ticket...
I'm a biker (although I haven't owned one now since 2002) and I know many bikers all over the UK. In the main, bikers are a group of people who are far more aware of their mortality than typical car drivers and so while they occasionally ride quickly when conditions allow, they also tend to avoid situations which will increase the odds of them getting killed or maimed, such as tailgating on motorways, or deliberately annoying car drivers while travelling at 70+ mph. Now of course there are some idiots on bikes, just as there are in cars, but the most sensible approach to dealing with them is to simply let them go about their business and stay out of their way. Spraying them with soapy water is not a good idea, not at all... :confused:
If a motorway is quiet, then of course it makes sense to use the left-hand lane, particularly as it's the only driving lane of the three available. However as Patrick says, during busy periods it's better to drive smoothly and safely by remaining in lane until a sizable space to the left presents itself. We all see self-righteous types weaving in and out of the left-lane to demonstrate their adherence to the perceived ideal of motorway conduct, but the weaving itself simply puts more wear on their tyres, causes others to brake and increases the chances for a collision of some sort. What I'm trying to say is that in spite of all the rules and regulations, it's better to be aware of your immediate circumstances and drive within them than to adhere religiously to a rule which doesn't account for them...........in fact it's a bit like photography in that respect :D
For what it's worth, I passed my (ordinary) test at 17 (back in 1986, when everything was rosy and Milton Keynes was just fields...) and then I passed my full bike test in 1994. I also passed the IAM test (in 1997), but to be honest I have learned more about road craft from personal experience than anything the IAM or anyone else could teach me.
Patrick
23-10-07, 07:44 PM
Actually Patrick, I think you may find the speed limit on a Dual Carriageway is 70, not 60. (unless otherwise sign posted to the contrary) :D
Just checked point conceded.
Patrick
Wow, there's lot's of credential-waving, pedantry and righteous indignation in this short thread, isn't there..? :rolleyes:
80mph certainly isn't a silly motorway speed these days, but of course it depends on the conditions (traffic levels, environment and weather) at the time. However no matter how you look at it, the speed limit is 70mph and so at 80, you are breaking the law. The approach by many forces is to give drivers a 10% margin for error plus around three MPH in terms of leeway, but this still assumes that the conditions are appropriate and that the driver is operating his or her vehicle in a competent fashion. In other words, 80mph can still get you a ticket...
I'm a biker (although I haven't owned one now since 2002) and I know many bikers all over the UK. In the main, bikers are a group of people who are far more aware of their mortality than typical car drivers and so while they occasionally ride quickly when conditions allow, they also tend to avoid situations which will increase the odds of them getting killed or maimed, such as tailgating on motorways, or deliberately annoying car drivers while travelling at 70+ mph. Now of course there are some idiots on bikes, just as there are in cars, but the most sensible approach to dealing with them is to simply let them go about their business and stay out of their way. Spraying them with soapy water is not a good idea, not at all... :confused:
If a motorway is quiet, then of course it makes sense to use the left-hand lane, particularly as it's the only driving lane of the three available. However as Patrick says, during busy periods it's better to drive smoothly and safely by remaining in lane until a sizable space to the left presents itself. We all see self-righteous types weaving in and out of the left-lane to demonstrate their adherence to the perceived ideal of motorway conduct, but the weaving itself simply puts more wear on their tyres, causes others to brake and increases the chances for a collision of some sort. What I'm trying to say is that in spite of all the rules and regulations, it's better to be aware of your immediate circumstances and drive within them than to adhere religiously to a rule which doesn't account for them...........in fact it's a bit like photography in that respect :D
For what it's worth, I passed my (ordinary) test at 17 (back in 1986, when everything was rosy and Milton Keynes was just fields...) and then I passed my full bike test in 1994. I also passed the IAM test (in 1997), but to be honest I have learned more about road craft from personal experience than anything the IAM or anyone else could teach me.
That sounds like a sensible attitude to driving. Like you say you learn more from experience than anything else. I got my first licence on Nov 8th 1957. God how the years fly. In all that time I've only had one ticket for 36mph in a built up area and I was going downhill at the time.:mad: In a few months I'll have to re-apply as it runs out when you get to 70. :\
Okey dokey, here's my two-penneth:
1. I live in Somerset and use the motorway network regularly. Not frequently, but regularly.
2. I drive, what some people might constitute to be, a "loutish" sports car (each to their own)
3. I do exceed the 70mph on motorways.
4. I do stick to 20/30mph limits in built up areas particularly around schools and school in/out times.
5. Whilst driving I concentrate on what is happening on the road ahead (as well as my rear view mirror!) without the distraction of a radio/cd or a mobile phone. I try not to be distracted by frequent and all too often inaccurate signs advising me of "speed cameras"
6. I despise and despair of "rubber-neckers".
7. I shake my head with a sorry disdain to those motorcyclists who, having paid their road tax, think that they have a God given right to weave, accelerate/decelerate and occupy any part of a highway they choose to, and, when brought to task, threaten personal and vehicular damage.
8. I have no sympathy, whatsoever, for pedal cyclists who blatantly disregard their own safety by not displaying adequate lighting whilst riding their bicycles at night on unlit roads.
9. Finally, don't start me off about people who insist on putting their fog lights on when it's raining.
I think you can gather in which camp my throttle is revving.
jo
"Forty may have been all right in 1870, but it's simply unacceptable now. If all the world did 40, it wouldn't work any more" Jeremy Clarkson
Patrick
23-10-07, 08:11 PM
Wow, there's lot's of credential-waving, pedantry and righteous indignation in this short thread, isn't there..? :rolleyes:
80mph certainly isn't a silly motorway speed these days, but of course it depends on the conditions (traffic levels, environment and weather) at the time. However no matter how you look at it, the speed limit is 70mph and so at 80, you are breaking the law. The approach by many forces is to give drivers a 10% margin for error plus around three MPH in terms of leeway, but this still assumes that the conditions are appropriate and that the driver is operating his or her vehicle in a competent fashion. In other words, 80mph can still get you a ticket...
I'm a biker (although I haven't owned one now since 2002) and I know many bikers all over the UK. In the main, bikers are a group of people who are far more aware of their mortality than typical car drivers and so while they occasionally ride quickly when conditions allow, they also tend to avoid situations which will increase the odds of them getting killed or maimed, such as tailgating on motorways, or deliberately annoying car drivers while travelling at 70+ mph. Now of course there are some idiots on bikes, just as there are in cars, but the most sensible approach to dealing with them is to simply let them go about their business and stay out of their way. Spraying them with soapy water is not a good idea, not at all... :confused:
If a motorway is quiet, then of course it makes sense to use the left-hand lane, particularly as it's the only driving lane of the three available. However as Patrick says, during busy periods it's better to drive smoothly and safely by remaining in lane until a sizable space to the left presents itself. We all see self-righteous types weaving in and out of the left-lane to demonstrate their adherence to the perceived ideal of motorway conduct, but the weaving itself simply puts more wear on their tyres, causes others to brake and increases the chances for a collision of some sort. What I'm trying to say is that in spite of all the rules and regulations, it's better to be aware of your immediate circumstances and drive within them than to adhere religiously to a rule which doesn't account for them...........in fact it's a bit like photography in that respect :D
For what it's worth, I passed my (ordinary) test at 17 (back in 1986, when everything was rosy and Milton Keynes was just fields...) and then I passed my full bike test in 1994. I also passed the IAM test (in 1997), but to be honest I have learned more about road craft from personal experience than anything the IAM or anyone else could teach me.
I have actual proved at least to myself that traveling faster at speed of 80 and over saves the driver very little in time.
Ever since I was booked for doing 84mpg in the inside lane on a deserted motorway a very rare event but it was the M180 going to Scunthorpe (enough said) I have attempted to follow the speed limits, an area we motorist are not well served with adequate signs on many roads, but that is another debate. In following these limits my arrival times changed little, but my petrol consumption improved immensely tyre wear is better, did over 50,000 on my last set, not to say the engine is less stressed, I have just past the 95,000 with my car and (touch wood) have not had big repair bills, just normal servicing costs, sorry did have some new brake cylinders last year.
Speed hits the pocket and bank balance, but gains little except frustration..
Patrick
"Forty may have been all right in 1870, but it's simply unacceptable now. If all the world did 40, it wouldn't work any more" Jeremy Clarkson
__________________
"I read this article that said the typical symptoms of stress are - eating too much; impulse buying and driving too fast. Are they kidding? That's my idea of a perfect day"
I hope you never have to tell someone you killed their child cos you were having a perfect day.
And there are far too many drivers think they are invincible, Jeremy Clarkson included.
Ron, please don't go all sanctimonious on me (I haven't been around long enough (photography wise) to use Ansel Adam quotes). I do not exceed speed limits any more than your "average joe public". I am acutely aware of other road users - pedestrian or otherwise and their own foibles/limitations. For nine years I drove a Nissan Micra 1.0 - I could have done as much damage in that as in my current vehicle. I didn't. I am a responsible and aware road user. No offence implied.
Jo
Ron, please don't go all sanctimonious on me (I haven't been around long enough (photography wise) to use Ansel Adam quotes). I do not exceed speed limits any more than your "average joe public". I am acutely aware of other road users - pedestrian or otherwise and their own foibles/limitations. For nine years I drove a Nissan Micra 1.0 - I could have done as much damage in that as in my current vehicle. I didn't. I am a responsible and aware road user. No offence implied.
Jo
None taken Jo. I'm glad you have made it clear that you are a responsible driver. I've seen two fatal accidents this month and wish they had really been pure accidents. The fact is they were both due to careless, thoughtless driving. I've had a few sleepless nights due to this. God knows what it's done to their loved ones.
coupekid
23-10-07, 09:31 PM
Okey dokey, here's my two-penneth:
1. I live in Somerset and use the motorway network regularly. Not frequently, but regularly.
2. I drive, what some people might constitute to be, a "loutish" sports car (each to their own)
Somerset is absolutely beautiful Jo, what you call a 'loutish sports car' I will probably drool over, so what is it? :D
You have to love Jeremy Clarksons quotes dont you!
I am currently reading his most recent book. Some of his ideologies I dont agree with, but many are I do!
Somerset is absolutely beautiful Jo, what you call a 'loutish sports car' I will probably drool over, so what is it? :D
You have to love Jeremy Clarksons quotes dont you!
I am currently reading his most recent book. Some of his ideologies I dont agree with, but many are I do!
Cor, Ben - this is just like going down the pub, without the beer *LOL
I have a pic of the JoJo Yellow Devil :D - Just looking for it now...
Ian
Mike Parr
23-10-07, 09:44 PM
I drive all day every day and it dosent make me a either a bad or good driver but I do notice lots of other drivers..............male/female...............old/young......everyone is capable of being stupid in their car.
For me I never rush anywhere, if it says 50 i like to drive at 50............70 is 70.
My mother a non driver always says when a car speeds by..."he wont get there any quicker"..........well in theory he will.:D and I love the way she looks when we pull up behind them 3 mile down the road:D
coupekid
23-10-07, 09:44 PM
Wow, there's lot's of credential-waving, pedantry and righteous indignation in this short thread, isn't there..? :rolleyes:
80mph certainly isn't a silly motorway speed these days, but of course it depends on the conditions (traffic levels, environment and weather) at the time. However no matter how you look at it, the speed limit is 70mph and so at 80, you are breaking the law. The approach by many forces is to give drivers a 10% margin for error plus around three MPH in terms of leeway, but this still assumes that the conditions are appropriate and that the driver is operating his or her vehicle in a competent fashion. In other words, 80mph can still get you a ticket...
I'm a biker (although I haven't owned one now since 2002) and I know many bikers all over the UK. In the main, bikers are a group of people who are far more aware of their mortality than typical car drivers and so while they occasionally ride quickly when conditions allow, they also tend to avoid situations which will increase the odds of them getting killed or maimed, such as tailgating on motorways, or deliberately annoying car drivers while travelling at 70+ mph. Now of course there are some idiots on bikes, just as there are in cars, but the most sensible approach to dealing with them is to simply let them go about their business and stay out of their way. Spraying them with soapy water is not a good idea, not at all... :confused:
If a motorway is quiet, then of course it makes sense to use the left-hand lane, particularly as it's the only driving lane of the three available. However as Patrick says, during busy periods it's better to drive smoothly and safely by remaining in lane until a sizable space to the left presents itself. We all see self-righteous types weaving in and out of the left-lane to demonstrate their adherence to the perceived ideal of motorway conduct, but the weaving itself simply puts more wear on their tyres, causes others to brake and increases the chances for a collision of some sort. What I'm trying to say is that in spite of all the rules and regulations, it's better to be aware of your immediate circumstances and drive within them than to adhere religiously to a rule which doesn't account for them...........in fact it's a bit like photography in that respect :D
For what it's worth, I passed my (ordinary) test at 17 (back in 1986, when everything was rosy and Milton Keynes was just fields...) and then I passed my full bike test in 1994. I also passed the IAM test (in 1997), but to be honest I have learned more about road craft from personal experience than anything the IAM or anyone else could teach me.
When you have moved out of their way two or three times Tim, and then they slow down in front of you each time, sometimes needs must! ;) Bottom line is, if a biker wants to shoot past, I will always move out of their way. In traffic jams, I will always allow space for a biker to get past. But when bikers act like idiots, the old red mist falls, so I just give them a cheeky blast on the wash wipe....if they kept their distance, chances are it wouldn't hit them anyway.
As for the credential waving pedantry etc....what do you expect when a load of blokes get together to talk about driving! You can almost smell the testosterone in the air. *LOL Youll also find that blokes that dont pass their test the first time will insist that people that pass second time are better drivers, which really makes me laugh (by the way, I passed first time at 17)
coupekid
23-10-07, 09:47 PM
Cor, Ben - this is just like going down the pub, without the beer *LOL
I have a pic of the JoJo Yellow Devil :D - Just looking for it now...
Ian
Haha, perfect for a non drinker like me then Ian! *LOL
I knew my posting that little rant would get the blood flowing! ;)
Patrick
23-10-07, 10:45 PM
Somerset is absolutely beautiful Jo, what you call a 'loutish sports car' I will probably drool over, so what is it? :D
You have to love Jeremy Clarksons quotes dont you!
Jeremy Clarkson I wouldn't pay him in washers, an overgrown 4 year old.
Patrick
Bearface
23-10-07, 11:18 PM
When you have moved out of their way two or three times Tim, and then they slow down in front of you each time, sometimes needs must! ;) Bottom line is, if a biker wants to shoot past, I will always move out of their way. In traffic jams, I will always allow space for a biker to get past. But when bikers act like idiots, the old red mist falls, so I just give them a cheeky blast on the wash wipe....if they kept their distance, chances are it wouldn't hit them anyway.
As for the credential waving pedantry etc....what do you expect when a load of blokes get together to talk about driving! You can almost smell the testosterone in the air. *LOL Youll also find that blokes that dont pass their test the first time will insist that people that pass second time are better drivers, which really makes me laugh (by the way, I passed first time at 17)
Sorry, but I think red mist is for angry bulls and 70's dance videos, not people piloting 1.5 tonne projectiles at 70+ MPH. I still say that if someone is repeatedly causing you problems on the road or motorway (and a biker who is clearly harrassing you without provocation is something of a rarity in my experience...), you can pull into the inside lane for a couple of minutes until he's out of your way completely. If his visor had been open and he'd got any of your screen wash in his eyes, you might've been facing a situation in which you'd be responsible for a death or serious injury and that's definitely not something they encourage on IAM courses...
Bearface
23-10-07, 11:19 PM
Jeremy Clarkson I wouldn't pay him in washers, an overgrown 4 year old.
Patrick
My Dad loathes him. I rather like him :o
Bearface
23-10-07, 11:49 PM
Okey dokey, here's my two-penneth:
7. I shake my head with a sorry disdain to those motorcyclists who, having paid their road tax, think that they have a God given right to weave, accelerate/decelerate and occupy any part of a highway they choose to, and, when brought to task, threaten personal and vehicular damage.
Please elaborate on "brought to task..." if you can. I'm just curious.
Motorcyclists do have a right to filter through slow, slower, slowing or stopped traffic. They can also filter past stationary queues down the white lines (not solid lines, naturally) and then move through gaps in the queues as necessary. Because they're compact, agile and responsive, it's possible (and legal) for motorcycles to do any of these things provided it's done safely. And most of the time it is.
Motorists who don't know the law affecting bikes often resent this (sad, but apparently true...) and when they see bikes filtering, they often deliberately obstruct them by moving closer to other cars or pulling closer to the white lines to force the biker into oncoming traffic. The less ballsy idiots just shout obscenities or shake their heads in disgust, but fortunately it's their ignorance rather than my riding that's the issue, so I ignore it. It's all happened to me countless times and although I've never felt the need to chin the perpetrators, I can perfectly understand why other riders might occasionally become slightly agitated...
Just one thing though. I've never seen riders accelerating and decelerating randomly and without reason. Usually they do it for the same reasons people in cars do it, to speed up or slow down.......and sometimes because blinkered, cocooned and strangely pompous car drivers simply fail to see them...
Bikers are more vulnerable to death or serious injury than car drivers
Bikers don't use mobile phones while riding
Bikers don't play with their sat nav while riding
Bikers don't change CDs or shout at their kids while riding
Bikers don't eat apples or drink bottles of water while riding
Bikers don't check themselves out in the mirror while riding
Bikers don't have seatbelts, airbags, EBD, traction control and crumple zones
Bikers pay for road tax, insurance and petrol, just like car drivers
Bikers are from all walks of life, just like car drivers
Bikers have made a valid choice and don't care if care drivers approve of it or not
Bikers are faster, more agile and can stop more quickly than car drivers
But it's bl**dy cold in winter....
coupekid
24-10-07, 09:19 AM
If his visor had been open and he'd got any of your screen wash in his eyes, you might've been facing a situation in which you'd be responsible for a death or serious injury and that's definitely not something they encourage on IAM courses...
Not at all, serves him right for driving too close! As the law goes, I dont read anywhere that when a biker is stuck on your rear bumper, you shouldnt clean your windscreen.
Bearface
24-10-07, 09:48 AM
Not at all, serves him right for driving too close! As the law goes, I dont read anywhere that when a biker is stuck on your rear bumper, you shouldnt clean your windscreen.
I see your point........if it's not written in the rule-book, it must be okay. And of course if a biker rides too close, they fully deserve a facefull of screen wash and the resulting injuries should the worst happen...
Out of interest, what do you do to car-drivers who tailgate you..? :rolleyes:
Patrick
24-10-07, 09:52 AM
Not at all, serves him right for driving too close! As the law goes, I dont read anywhere that when a biker is stuck on your rear bumper, you shouldnt clean your windscreen.
Two wrongs don't make it right, and the law if they could prove your actions may consider it dangerous driving.
I myself get extremely irritated by drivers that flash their lights for whatever reason they get in their heads. One did it in Southport at traffic lights just last week, the lights had just gone to amber and he was flashing his lights for me to move, my reaction I crawled for some distance. I felt it made a point, I know it was silly but it wasn't dangerous.
Patrick
I have been scared witless many times by bikers on very powerful bikes appearing out of nowhere at insanely high speed, both while driving and as a pedestrian. I'm sure they are a minority and not representative of the majority of bikers, but I feel I see more bikers abusing the road in this manner than car drivers. There is more scope for bikers to abuse the road as they can use parts of the road that car drivers can't and, in general, they have much faster machinery than cars.
However, I feel that if a biker wants to endanger his or her life by driving recklessly, it's not helping anyone by car drivers making things even more dangerous like squirting washers at them.
I always try to leave a bit of extra room for a bike if it's passing - but that's impossible if they are going far too fast, which is often the case.
There are reckless car drivers too and when they get it wrong the consequences can be even greater, but I just think that for bikers, the temptation and the ease of being able to abuse the road is greater - for some at least. Thank goodness the number of bikes compared to cars is relatively small.
Ian
coupekid
24-10-07, 11:48 AM
However, I feel that if a biker wants to endanger his or her life by driving recklessly, it's not helping anyone by car drivers making things even more dangerous like squirting washers at them.
I dont mind them endangering themselves, its when they sit on my bumper, and endanger me, and who ever else is in the car that winds me up.
OK, this has been a very interesting thread, and I am not suprised by the reception I got in what I choose to do.
Bottom line, if your on a bike, dont sit on the back of cars with your high beam on, if I leave you room to overtake, dont repay the compliment, by overtaking and then slowing down because your 'mates' are catching you up, making me have to over take you again.
If you choose to sit on my bumper, I may well have to clean my windscreen, so dont grizzle if you happen to be behind me 6 inches from my bumper. If you left a sensible space behind me, you wouldnt be caught anyway.
As for what I do when cars tailgate me, the same as I do for bikes, that is, I pull in and let them pass. Generally speaking though, once this has been done, they dont then slow down again, they get on with what they are doing. If I cant let them pass, then i simply slow down, to allow enough space in front of me, so If the car in front of me has to brake, I dont have to do an emergency stop.
So there it is, I realise many of you dont approve of my actions, but what the hey! If your on a bike, just dont tailgate a silver Honda with your high beam on and youll be fine! ;)
Evening Ben,
It's an S2000
Jo
Bearface
24-10-07, 06:19 PM
Interesting stuff........it appears that car drivers notice the few idiots on bikes far more easily than they do the countless moronic car drivers who plague our roads and motorways. Still, I suppose it's a natural human instinct to fear, judge or be suspicious of things we are not familiar with.
If any of you non-biking drivers could spend an hour riding pillion with a biker, you'd soon learn to appreciate that the bulk of the danger and prejudice comes from the four-wheeled community and not - as you appear to think - from the bikers themselves. Most bikers drive cars, but only a tiny percentage of car drivers ride bikes, so I guess we'll have to resign ourselves to the fact that ignorance will continue to reign among drivers, at least where motorcycling is concerned.
On the subject of bikes on "full beam".........go and ask any biker you know (even a police biker) why riders often have their lights on (not on full beam, but on dipped beam.......it only looks bright because the light is set higher than a car headlight) and the answer will always be the same: Car drivers are constantly pulling out into the paths of motorcyclists (hence the stark ad campaign on the TV), so we try to increase our chances of survival by switching our lights on.......not that it makes too much of a difference :rolleyes:
Look out for silver Hondas? I think you'll find bikers are looking out for anything with four wheels generally, but no doubt the threat of a few squirts of screen-wash in the face will raise eyebrows among even the most hardened and street-wise bikers who might be reading this...
Evening Tim,
The words "brought to task" were probably not the best description. However the experience that I was particularly thinking about happened earlier this year. I had finished a late shift at work and was driving home about 23.30. A couple of miles from home I picked up the headlight of a bike in my rear view mirror. The rider approached and stuck right on my tail. As we continued into an unlit open countryside road the biker overtook me (don't have problem with that whatsoever) and then pulled directly in front of me causing me to brake sharply (not helped by his minuscule brake light) and then slowed to less than 20mph (I can be quite precise about this because my speedo readout is large digital numbers). I did not make any attempt to overtake him (fruitless exercise car vs bike). He slowed further to less than 15mph. I pulled over. He pulled over. I got out of the car and ask him what is problem was. Without using his colourful language he called me a rather unflattering name, said he should give me a good slapping and then threatened to kick my wings in. I got back in my car and waved him on. He refused to move off. I then had to continue my drive home with him behind me again. I was concerned he might follow me home so I drove some way passed where I live turned off down a different road. He stayed on the main road. So, may be the words "questioned their mentality" would have been more appropriate.
I have as much respect for the majority of bikers as I do any competent road user, but maybe its "the female in a proper sports car" that some (not necessarily bikers) can't handle? Their problem, not mine. And I'll just leave it at that.
jo
Bearface
24-10-07, 07:29 PM
Evening Tim,
The words "brought to task" were probably not the best description. However the experience that I was particularly thinking about happened earlier this year. I had finished a late shift at work and was driving home about 23.30. A couple of miles from home I picked up the headlight of a bike in my rear view mirror. The rider approached and stuck right on my tail. As we continued into an unlit open countryside road the biker overtook me (don't have problem with that whatsoever) and then pulled directly in front of me causing me to brake sharply (not helped by his minuscule brake light) and then slowed to less than 20mph (I can be quite precise about this because my speedo readout is large digital numbers). I did not make any attempt to overtake him (fruitless exercise car vs bike). He slowed further to less than 15mph. I pulled over. He pulled over. I got out of the car and ask him what is problem was. Without using his colourful language he called me a rather unflattering name, said he should give me a good slapping and then threatened to kick my wings in. I got back in my car and waved him on. He refused to move off. I then had to continue my drive home with him behind me again. I was concerned he might follow me home so I drove some way passed where I live turned off down a different road. He stayed on the main road. So, may be the words "questioned their mentality" would have been more appropriate.
I have as much respect for the majority of bikers as I do any competent road user, but maybe its "the female in a proper sports car" that some (not necessarily bikers) can't handle? Their problem, not mine. And I'll just leave it at that.
jo
Wow, it sounds as if you got yourself a full-on nutcase there :eek:
Seriously, I don't know what motivated the biker to overtake and then slow right down to deliberately antagonize you, but it sounds remarkably like the scenario Ben has described! To be honest, I think that in both cases it's been down to moronic individuals and their attitudes rather than being in any way to do with which form of transport they've been on (or in).
There are of course those feeble little men who feel threatened or intimidated by women who drive nice cars, but I can't imagine that this biker was angry with you for that reason alone. He probably thought you'd been deliberately holding him up, or something like that..........but I guess we'll never know.
There are several Honda S2000s around here, but sadly they're all driven by middle-aged men. For me - as with Subaru Imprezas and Mitsubishi Evos - it's a car which looks far better with a woman in the driving seat. Less desperate, somehow... :)
coupekid
24-10-07, 09:25 PM
Evening Ben,
It's an S2000
Jo
Oh sweet!
Thats a proper sports car!
:D
coupekid
24-10-07, 09:43 PM
Interesting stuff........it appears that car drivers notice the few idiots on bikes far more easily than they do the countless moronic car drivers who plague our roads and motorways. Still, I suppose it's a natural human instinct to fear, judge or be suspicious of things we are not familiar with.
If any of you non-biking drivers could spend an hour riding pillion with a biker, you'd soon learn to appreciate that the bulk of the danger and prejudice comes from the four-wheeled community and not - as you appear to think - from the bikers themselves. Most bikers drive cars, but only a tiny percentage of car drivers ride bikes, so I guess we'll have to resign ourselves to the fact that ignorance will continue to reign among drivers, at least where motorcycling is concerned.
On the subject of bikes on "full beam".........go and ask any biker you know (even a police biker) why riders often have their lights on (not on full beam, but on dipped beam.......it only looks bright because the light is set higher than a car headlight) and the answer will always be the same: Car drivers are constantly pulling out into the paths of motorcyclists (hence the stark ad campaign on the TV), so we try to increase our chances of survival by switching our lights on.......not that it makes too much of a difference :rolleyes:
Look out for silver Hondas? I think you'll find bikers are looking out for anything with four wheels generally, but no doubt the threat of a few squirts of screen-wash in the face will raise eyebrows among even the most hardened and street-wise bikers who might be reading this...
Dont get me wrong Tim, I am not against bikers at all. I am just against idiot bikers, the same as I am against idiot car drivers.
I have been on the back of countless bikes riding pillion. In fact, one of my best mates (to whom I am going to be best man next year :D ) is a big hairy lairy biker. He is more into bikes than just about anyone I know. My brother in law is also a biker. I also used to work in a pub frequented by bikers. (non of whom felt the need to dress up like a power ranger as Clarkson used to say ;) )
I am not convenced with what you say about high beam lights on bikes. If it is the case, my suggestion is that they are not correctly adjusted, no light, on a car or bike should blind any motorist, in a car or otherwise.
I dont think a streetwise biker would be daft enough to over take a vehicle and slow down like a numpty, so I cant see it raising the eyebrows of any such person. ;)
paul.r.w
25-10-07, 12:07 AM
Well as an ex motorbike courier, I'm saying nothing!!! :D
Well as an ex motorbike courier, I'm saying nothing!!! :D
You weren't the 1996 F1 champ were you? :rolleyes:
Ian
I've come to this discussion rather late, but hope I can still add my twopennethworth...
Like Ben, I do have a tendency to flick the wash/wipe when there's a tailgating car behind me but have never tried it (nor intend to) on a biker. That's not a criticism Ben, there is a reason for this.
In my youf, I often rode pillion but never learned to ride a bike itself and have always tried to treat bike riders with respect. Now, however, I have a phobia, although it is beginning to improve, with time.
About 5 years ago, just after doing my first first-aid course, I was in an accident with a motorbike.
The biker pulled out to overtake a stationary vehicle that was indicating to turn right. I was coming down a hill towards this, and had already started braking when he overtook, and was stationary by the time he hit me. To cut it short, reversed off him, made sure he was breathing, called emergency services, performed cpr on and off for 20 minutes until he died in my arms. He was 22, the same age as my daughter, and I found out at the inquest that I knew his mother. Shock didn't set in for a week, and guilt that I hadn't been able to save him.
So I'm the one who bumps along the verge or heads for the scenery when there's a biker behind me - cars I can cope with. And I'm the one who pulls over with a panic attack if I do get a tailgating biker for any distance.
Caz, that's a really moving story. It's very sad when you are faced with the harsh reality of the incident in your very own personal space. Alas, it just reinforces my feeling that some bikers can and do take amazingly bad risks. I have experienced a few lunatic car moves in my almost 30 years of driving but far more loons on bikes - and they do more outrageous things in my opinion; giving all the sensible bikers out there an unnecessarily bad name.
I'm glad to hear that you are slowly getting over it - will probably take many years.
I've been in two moderately bad traffic accidents. One was with a drunk driver and the other was a lunatic in a range rover who decided to over take me by going straght across a mini roundabout while I was turning (and indicating) to come back the way I had come... I had mild shock in both cases and it's not nice; but yours must have been devastating.
Ian
coupekid
27-10-07, 10:19 AM
I've come to this discussion rather late, but hope I can still add my twopennethworth...
Like Ben, I do have a tendency to flick the wash/wipe when there's a tailgating car behind me but have never tried it (nor intend to) on a biker. That's not a criticism Ben, there is a reason for this.
In my youf, I often rode pillion but never learned to ride a bike itself and have always tried to treat bike riders with respect. Now, however, I have a phobia, although it is beginning to improve, with time.
About 5 years ago, just after doing my first first-aid course, I was in an accident with a motorbike.
The biker pulled out to overtake a stationary vehicle that was indicating to turn right. I was coming down a hill towards this, and had already started braking when he overtook, and was stationary by the time he hit me. To cut it short, reversed off him, made sure he was breathing, called emergency services, performed cpr on and off for 20 minutes until he died in my arms. He was 22, the same age as my daughter, and I found out at the inquest that I knew his mother. Shock didn't set in for a week, and guilt that I hadn't been able to save him.
So I'm the one who bumps along the verge or heads for the scenery when there's a biker behind me - cars I can cope with. And I'm the one who pulls over with a panic attack if I do get a tailgating biker for any distance.
God thats awfull!
Sounds to me that you dont have anything to feel guilty about Caz.
Have you considered hypnotherapy for your panic attacks?